9 sept 2013



Thanks to Josh for his help with the english version.

68 comentarios:

  1. ¿Ese ruído es un pedo? ¡Puaj! Te compadezco Alex...

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  2. esa es la clase de confianza que tengo con mi novio, y prefiero ese tipo de relación a cualquier otra ;) si mi novio no se peyera delante de mí, me preocuparía... querría decir que no me considera lo suficientemente cercano para ser él mismo.

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    Respuestas
    1. Yo tengo mucha confianza con mi novio también, pero te aseguro que los pedos nos los guardamos para el cuarto de baño jajaja. Y aun así, nos sentimos muy cerca el uno del otro.

      Supongo que todas las opciones son buenas siempre que ambas partes de la pareja se sientan cómodas.

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    2. Una cosa es la "confianza" y otra muy distinta es el "respeto". No hay que confundir la una con la otra.

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  3. Hooray! To be honest, I've been waiting for this since last week XD
    And yeah, when you're in a relationship for a long time, you ended up becoming like a sibling that you love to hate and hate to love hahaha

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  4. yay finally a black character who is not bald and ripped! All my friends and I were like " the comic is nice but whats with the sterotypical black guys?"

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    Respuestas
    1. You know here in Spain there aren't many black guys, not to mention black gay guys, and the ones you can see and meet are mostly what you call "sterotypical black guys". Also, the bald and ripped guy is the same character in all the strips.

      I'm glad you like this new character, though.

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    2. Have you ever had the thought that black gay men are pressured to look that way because of white gay expectation like here in the US or what I and my friends experience in France/Netherlands/UK?

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    3. Like have you ever thought while making a comic series that actively and passively breaks gay stereotypes you aren't solidifying white(mainstream) notions of black gay men?

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    4. Anonymous, stop projecting your western mainstream views to everybody else. It's extremely ethnocentric and makes you look like a tool.

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    5. What are you talking about the person making these comics are portraying the White and Western idea and gay Western ideal of black men. Asian media and fashion markets are the same as the west in regards to the portrayal and treatment of black bodies. Read you history and prospective as I am of the Global South and am not a Westerner

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    6. The thing is that, so far, I only have two black characters in my comic, and I don't find them to be specially stereotypical no matter where I look. You say one of them is stereotypical only because he has shaved short hair and has a built body, which I think is kind of a baseless personal opinion of yours and, if you ask me, kind of prejudiced and superficial.

      If you feel pressured to look like anyone just because of a representation of an human being in a comic (no matter if he's built, skinny or fat) then I think the problem is yours, regardless of race issues. I have drawn muscled guys of all races, and skinny guys of all races as well. If you want to blame me for drawing too many muscled guys, then do it, because I do. But accusing me of "solidifying" an stereotype of a black person just because one of my characters happens to be black and muscled is just stupid.

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    7. How was I to know the Moreno was the same person over and over again if they didn't have a name? (Most don't have names so I thought you had multiple no name black characters) however having one character like that is just a bad.

      I am not saying your comic is making me pressured I am saying the character is a trite archetype common in non-black artist depictions of black men. Look yourself in gay media outlets its a juxtaposition between extremes that are common in the west (ultra femme sassy queen/ultra butch black man) that's not just my opinion that's just fact.

      If you want I can go on tumblr and have a general vote or opinion poll of black gay men and see how they feel about the played out bald, butch, bulk, black character who is a top and I can guarantee the majority consensus will be one of fatigue regarding such a tired representation.

      I mean your about breaking stereotypes, why not break all the stereotypes that affect the gay community regardless of their color. I mean its not like you're racist or see nothing wrong in pigeonholing a entire section of the community into some small box based on you see just like straight people may do to us when they see some extreme character who happens to be gay right? :-)

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    8. Also note that this conversation started only after you made an excuse about the cliché character right? I was happy about the new character and was encouraging your branching out kindly trying to get you to move past the first one but I guess that was an insult.

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    9. First of all, I've never proclaimed myself or my comic as an stereotype breaker, nor is my intention to do so. I don't have the power to do so, and I'm not sure if I would like to do that. Unlike some people, I don't feel so offended by stereotypes if these aren't portrayed in a negative way, especially knowing people like these so called "stereotypes" exists in reality and do no harm to anybody.

      Second, I don't see my character the way you see it. He's not bald, but has his hair very short. I've never ever said he was a top, that's just your own assumption and, if you let me add it, your own prejudice. Third, butch? What do you know about this character to call him butch? I have barely shown any aspect of his personality yet to call him butch...

      Also, I don't understand why you think he exists so an "entire section of the community" could feel represented by him. He's not there to represent anyone. He's just a character, like any other character I've created, and he doesn't represent a whole community or ethnic group. He's an individual. All my characters are individuals. You can feel more or less affinity with them, but they're not there to represent anyone. If you feel so offended by him, let me tell you are being quite intolerant, because guys like him exists and do you no harm. Putting him the label of "stereotypical bald black guy" is what I find rude and offensive.

      I feel like you want to put my character in the same box of other characters who are negatively stereotypical to defend your ideas, and so you made up his personality/preferences to make your point stronger, but that's not the character I've created. As I said, when I did say he was a top?

      About the names... I don't put names to my characters generally, only a few them have and it's because people asked me to do so, except for Jaime. But that character obviously was the same in all the strips. It's not hard to tell.

      If you're trying to threaten me with the tumblr poll thing, well, it's your decission. I already don't give a damn about these things anymore. I'm very comfortable with the work I've done yet and I'm very confident about what I think.

      Let me tell you that your first message was very passive aggressive. If you just wanted to congratulate me for making this new character, you could have done so without dragging the other one or accusing me of racism/ignorant, which was implied in your message.

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    10. Two things, I'll try to make them quick because I like to write a lot, but there's a couple of things I wanted to point out.

      You're right, the first message came off a bit passive aggressive. There are certainly better ways he could have handled it. However, take a step back for a second and think about it from his perspective; someone who is not only marginalized because of his sexuality, but his race as well. And how hyperaware he would be to fictional depictions of his own race.

      I don't imagine that being passive aggressive was ever his intent. Just like it was never your intent to portray black men as he suggested. I don't think you have either, but I'm not black so there's things that I might not pick up on or realize. I think it was an honest attempt to give you encouragement.

      Also, I think you need to give yourself a little credit man. Entertainment: art, literature, television, comics; all of these different mediums drive social change. You do have that power. And to be honest, you're doing AWESOME at it.

      Seriously, you are depicting a realism of gay culture that most gay men want to pretend doesn't exist. The GLBT community has gotten so caught up in trying to make us look 'normal', that we push each other to conform to a heteronormative society. We have moved away from treating sex as a celebration and having fun with it, and we try so hard to shame those that still do.

      You're not reinforcing stereotypes by any means. Are some of your characters stereotypical? They sure are, but you depict them with an element of realism, you don't make fun of those stereotypes, those traits are a part of certain characters, and you have always treated it with respect.

      This comic right here is a perfect example, here we have a wonderful example of how opposites attract one another; on one hand you have a "stereotypical" guy, and on the other you have a more masculine 'bro' like guy. Their relationship has made me chuckle on more then one occasion, and not only that I see the truth behind fiction, I know that gay men like both of these guys, like all the men you depict exist. You are showing elements of diversity in the gay community that I have never seen before.

      Then there's this comic: http://gaysomecomic.blogspot.ca/2013/07/28-gays-en-la-tele-gays-on-tv.html#more

      In this strip you did a fantastic job of looking at different opinions on the representation of gay culture in the media. Not only did you do it in a way that kind of pokes fun at the idea that sometimes we only see what we want to see, but the last panel? Was hilarious but at the same time so completely true. You threw it in the faces of your readers and made them think, 'Hey, he's right, we don't see Lesbians really all that much. That's a bit of a problem.'

      To be fair, I have noticed a lack of ethnodiversity in your strip, but I also know and realize that there actually isn't a lot of ethnodiversity in a lot of countries that are not English speaking. Not to say that there isn't any, but as you pointed out there isn't a lot of Black people in Spain. You're a writer, you're a creator, and you draw from your own experiences to create what you do, I think some people would be better off if they understood that.

      You are doing an awesome job with this comic, and I tip my hat to you. IT's refreshing to see the amount of realism you put in your comic behind the jokes. I have actually used your comic in certain ways to create and generate dialogue with friends of mine on facebook because so often your right on the money. Don't let the haters get you down man, you've created something great here; it just keeps getting better as you develop characters.

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    11. Thank you very much for your comment, David O. I really enjoyed reading your opinion about my comic, and it made me feel like I'm not doing it so bad. It's wonderful when I find people like you who doesn't see my comic in a superficial way, but also see other details that most people don't usually see or appreciate.

      Really, thank you. It was very special to read it.

      I think you may be partly right about Anon and his perspective, and maybe I should have handle this issue more carefully too. I apologize to him for that. I understand it's a very sensitive topic, especially in the USA and other countries where there are still marginalized people because of their race. However, it wasn't my intention to depict a character who was a race stereotype, and I still think I didn't depict one. My problem with the Anon was that he tried to accuse me of racism describing my character as multiple stereotyped characters and later adding "facts" to him that were false, everything just to justify his point. That's manipulation, from the way I see it.

      I agree with you that my comic should have more ethnodiversity, especially if mine was an american comic. But for spanish readers, I think it would feel kinda unrealistic. I actually depict latin american characters more often because there are more latin americans living here, but not so many black people. Spain also has a big number of chinese population, but unfortunately they barely have any kind of relationship with spanish population. In the gay community, these numbers are even lower. However, I'll try to add ethnodiversity to my comic from now on (I just hope people don't find those characters stereotypical and stuff, that's my biggest fear...).

      Thank you again, for your comment and also for your politeness. I wish there where more people like you who could tell me things like the ethnodiversity thing in such a polite and friendly way.

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    12. I did not say you were racist or that your comic is racist I said the character you made is continuing a racist caricature of black gay men.

      To quote you:

      Hey! ^.^ I absolutely love your comics! Especially the last one, me and my bf look nothing alike, he's skinny and I'm chubby(I'm not a "bear or cub") were both only 18 but in the gay community when we walk together holding hands is like we're both crazy for dating someone out of our "group" >.>
      "Actually, I think you got what I was trying to point out with this strip. Thank you. Me and my bf are nothing alike too, and when we came across other gay couples that REALLY look alike, they look at us like we are from another planet hehe."


      This was the question that I saw when first going on your page that got me to follow you. This answer; intentionally bring attention to or point out a person/people who are gay and who deal with a certain level of invisibility or "othering" by other gay couples.

      You use your comics to portray characters you feel aren't often seen by themselves or together, you say

      "...en mis dibujos para dar paso a la representación de vivencias" You said when asked why you pick the people you pick that it goes beyond sexual attraction and become ONE OF REPRESENTATION

      That is image politics, I was confused why you didn't go further by challenging the image politics around people of color in queer settings

      Also don't assume simply because I am black I am not Latino I am both one does not cancel the other a lot of Afro-Latinos immigrate to Spain and exist around the world from Argentina to Canada to Spain and beyond Hispanophone media ALWAYS underrepresents Moreno people and culture and forces stereotypes based around sex and violence intentionally or otherwise.

      19, 23, 29, 31 all his appearances coincide with overt sexual overtones whereas other characters with the same number of appearances are shown some depths of romanticism/non-sexuality that go beyond sexuality.

      Only two comics 20&32 show two characters directly having sex with one another and the one he appears in he is the top.

      Also he is bald, Americans call his haircut a "bald fade"

      I am not pulling things out of mid-air these portrayals are all I see in the gay western media, what do aspect but for me being FUCKING HAPPY THAT YOU WERE DOING SOMETHING DIFFERENT WITH A NEW CHARACTER????!!!! But no you get offended and attack my view when you tell people to comment, you got defensive and attacked me for my happiness that you aren't just drawing a heavily sexualized, muscular, bald, black man.

      This kind of stuff is the reason why a lot of black gays don't even associate with other groups because other people don't get what we see or refuse to recognize any validity in our remarks towards gay mainstream culture and brush it off as merely making things up.

      Do I think you did anything personally, no. That is because just like straight people not HAVING to be aware of what is offensive/rude/cliche/trite to gay people; non-black people don't have to know what is offensive/rude/cliche/trite to black people (its even worse when you're both)

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    13. You can say I was being neither polite or kind but really you were the one who shut out the substance of what I was saying in my first comment and assumed I was on an attack mode when really I WAS COMMENDING YOU!

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    14. I didn't like the way you congratulated me, nor I like the way you justify my character is a caricature or whatever. He's actually not the character in strip 32 (I didn't even remember I painted the top in this strip black), this is a faceless character. And, believe me as I'm the author, I've never said he was a TOP or showed him as a TOP. If you see strip 29, he's actually in a position for bottoming. So, yes, you made your own assumptions about this character. I didn't even give him butch attitude as you said... But I want to settle this, so I won't mention it again.

      While I understand your point of view, I still think my character is Ok. I try to see it by your perspective, and I understand what you're saying, but I know there are gay people who look (because, at the end, the problem for you is his looks) like him. Actually, the only black gay guy I've met in person in my entire life looks like him. He was gay, he was muscled, and he has his hair styled that way. He was very polite too, and not a butch. I find disrespectful to reduce him and the people styled like him to "white people standards of black gay guys."

      I agree with you that I should have portrayed more kinds of black gay men, though. But I don't understand why you attacked this character and, indirectly, me, to let me know this. You could you have said: "there's only one black character in your comic, how about creating more and giving them different looks so more people can feel represented?". That would have been a nice way to approach me about this problem.

      I also agree with you that this character has only been involved in sexual situations. See? I can accept when I do wrong. This is true, and I didn't notice it. I'll try to give him more types of stories in the future.

      Lastly, I invite you to see things from non-americans perspective before you adress issues like these. I'm trying to understand your feelings, and accepted the things I consider I did wrong.

      I apologize to you for getting in defense mode. I should have let you know my point of view in a more relaxed way. Also, while I won't be eliminating Jaime's roommate as I don't see any problem with him, I promise to include more people of colour in my comic who look different.

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    15. My english is just too bad. I hope there's no misunderstanding.

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    16. Anonymous could just not read the comics to make things easier, trying to start all of this unnecessary drama and whatnot. In the words of Sweet Brown, "Ain't nobody got time for dat!" #sityourassdown

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    17. DongSaeng -- please ignore any and all negativity from readers like Anónimo. I do not want you feel sad as you did a few months back when you gave up doing the comic. Please remember that for every one bitchy, sensitive person who is complaining, there are dozens of us who support you and love your work -- we are just much more quiet! :) It is YOUR comic, you can do whatever you want with it (I just wish you would show some nudity and sex!) ;)

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    18. Anónimo - Seriously, you have a point, and they're all valid. But you need to stop looking at this comic as being from the mainstream gay media, it's not, he's coming from Spain. Queer culture there and Queer culture here in North America are two completely different things.

      You're completely right though, there are huge problems about the depictions of characters who are racially marginalized all over the map. But I have to be honest, this is a comic about sex, most of the comics sexualize all the characters in it. It seems odd to get up in arms that the black guy is having sex.

      But that's neither hear nor there, I'm a white guy, so I have the privilege of being able to see it another way.

      You're original comment was bit of a back handed compliment though.

      "yay finally a black character who is not bald and ripped! All my friends and I were like " the comic is nice but whats with the sterotypical black guys?""

      I mean, I'm not going to tell you you're not wrong, because you do have a point. But Dong is writing a comic which is obviously drawn from his own experiences and the experiences of his friends, (sorry if that's too much of a logically leap Dong), he creates and see what he sees around him, I mean that's what i get.

      If I was to write a webcomic bases on my own experiences, and drawing from the experienced of my friends, it would probably be quite white washed too. Not to say that I don't have any friends of colour, but the majority of them are white, and I live in North America. A lot of that would also be me being nervous about whether or not I could portray such a character correctly.

      There's a lot of stuff to unpack with what you said, and although there's truth to you it, it was said in such that way that put Dong on the defensive.

      I really think this entire thing was a failure to communicate.

      I think it might have been much better to say, even if you still wanted to keep the commentary of what you've noticed:

      I love that you've got another black character here! It's nice to see something that reflects a different type of black guy, then the bald buff guys you've had before! It's great to see something that I, or my friends can identify with more! Thanks!

      That comment points out that you loved seeing it, points out the observation, and thanks Dong for taking a further step. Which if it had been me, I would have felt all warm and fuzzy and maybe made plans to have that character show up again soon.

      Let's all just play Candy Crush and be happy okay. XD

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    19. Este comentario ha sido eliminado por el autor.

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  5. Absolutamente divertida como siempre, te felicito por tu trabajo, cuanto me gustaria que colgaras aca la historieta de Eric y Alex que publicastes para Sextories...

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  6. Patienceand tolerance are almost as important as love, in a relationship. But
    some hints at not being a slob would be in order, there...

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  7. Me parece que Jennifer Aniston y Brad Pitt pasaron por una escena semejante a la viñeta 3. La camiseta de dormir de Álex es muy graciosa.

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  8. Conocí tu página hace más o menos tres meses pero es la primera vez que pongo un comentario. Haces un trabajo estupendo, las viñetas son muy divertidas y graciosas! Eric y Alex son adorables!
    felicidades por tu trabajo!!

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  9. Jajajjaa, me sentí tan identificado... :P Excelente trabajo Dong! En qué trabaja Eric?

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    Respuestas
    1. Eric está en paro ahora mismo, como la gran mayoria de los españoles :(

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  10. Jajaja ¡pero qué divino y princesito es Álex y qué panchurrón es Eric!
    Tal para cual ;)

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  11. hahahaha nice one, i really wouldn't mind all those things if only i could have a relationship like that... *desperate* xD
    -kyle-

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  12. xDDDDDDDDDD Puede ser algo incomodo pero es rico que alguien te tenga asi tanta confianza xDDDD a mi no me importaria con ese tal Eric que salpice y olorize lo que desee :v

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  13. Gracias!!! al fin alex y eric d vuelta, sobre todo eric(mi amor platoniko).. :)
    como siempre bn trabajo y muy divertido..saluditos desde Colombia.

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  14. La camiseta de Cuatricromia hahah lo mejor de lo mejor, creo que soy ese personaje.

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  15. "¿Has visto qué culazo tenía el tío ese?"
    comentario como los que yo suelo hacer jajjaja

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  16. Jejejeje! Muuuy buenos!!
    Curioso, los dos amigos trabajan en una Fnac... Es por alguna percepción personal? =]
    Fangoria... me recuerda Cachorro, la conocí por la película.

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    Respuestas
    1. Si me preguntas si pienso que todos los trabajadores de la Fnac son gays, no, no lo creo :P

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  17. Mis mejores deseos para el autor de éstos cómics, son muy buenos :)

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  18. me encantan mucho tus comics son geniales siempre los leo ~~~

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  19. I was gonna say, "its never like that in my relationship!" then I realized I am the one doing all those things to my boyfriend lol. love it keep em coming :)

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  20. Gracias por todos vuestros comentarios.

    Thanks for the comments :D

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  21. Cuatricromía, gran disco... y por su puesto, una gran tira también :)

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  22. Hmmm... Ahora me da curiosidad saber en que trabaja...
    Por que no creo que el letreo FMAO (Fuck My Ass Off)del 4to cuadro sea correcto XD

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    Respuestas
    1. Álex trabaja en "fmac" (su versión de los centros comerciales "fnac" jaja) ;)

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  23. jajaja en toda relacion se llega a ese punto. me encanta este comic, se ha vuelto todo un icono en latinoamerica. es como una referencia cultural!

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  24. JAJAJAJAJAJA XD buena esa, aunque se de la confianza en las relaciones uno debe saber cuando callar y cuando ser reservado con su pareja :P muy buena jejeje

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  25. Just a note on the English translation; colloquially people very rarely use the word 'bum'. You'll hear 'ass' or 'butt' more often then not. Not to say you'd never hear 'bum' but just thought I'd mention it. :)

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  26. Whoa, didn't realize there would be so many comments. Just wanted to say I'm a super long-time reader, ever since the first strip (and since you arrived on ygal!) and you are amazing.

    I finally broke on this strip because all of the characters' clothes are amazing and I WANT! Keep going with your fantastic strip!

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  27. ajjajajajjaja muy chistoso saludos desde Chile

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  28. Te AMO Eric. Be mine. Jaja

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  29. Pues el cuadro que me llama mas la atencion es el de los celos, a muchas parejas les pasa eso, se aburren de ser siempre los 2 e intentan meter a alguien en la relacion... (No se porque pongo esto, en realidad no tiene nada que ver con el "comic") Gracias por hacer este trabajo Dong :-) Por cierto, publicarán (en la web) como se conocieron ellos 2? :-/ Te mando un beso (para tu mejilla) :-)

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  30. ASH , es mi situación actual con mi novio jajajaja

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  31. Pues yo me parto cada vez que alguno de los dos se tira un pedo! Jajajaja

    Pero las expresiones de Álex son impagables XD

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  32. Oye, si se agotan las ediciones de sextories de alex y eric, estarán disponibles las descargas?

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  33. What coincidence,my name is Alex and husbands name is Eric. That's the only common thing we have with your characters though. Haha.

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  34. alex ha sido boyfriendzoned xD

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  35. Alex y Eric son mis personajes preferidos!!! Los amo!!! Quice comprar las sex stories pero no envian a otros lugares fuera de España. Como puedo hacer? Me muero por ver la historia hot de como se conocieron!!

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  36. LOS AMO, SON MI INSPIRACIÓN PARA HACER VIDEOS :)
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5toZf7N4lc0&feature=c4-overview&list=UU_ed_M82_7RlbAm4OY5jwnw

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  38. Que morbo con esos dos chavales, me gustaría que me pasara algo igual :P

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  39. Me gusto mucho ese comic porno me hice varias pajas jejejej....

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